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Connect with Jamie

📲 Instagram: @legaliving

🖥 Website: legaliving.com

Episode Transcript

Ryann

Hello everybody, welcome back. I’m so excited for this episode. I was just telling Jamie right now that literally since we scheduled this episode, I’ve had so many of you reach out about gut health and bloating and IBS and all that jazz. And so we are diving in today to give you all the answers, all the tea on having a healthy, happy tummy and living and eating in a way where you don’t have to worry about all of that stuff. So Jamie, thank you so much for coming on. I am so excited for our conversation.

Jamie

I am too, thank you for having me.

Ryann

Absolutely, okay, so I wanna know before we dive in, like, I always am really curious, like how did you get interested in gut health? Where did this all start? What’s your story? Give it to us.

Jamie

Sure, so my reason why I became a dietitian and my story are kind of the same answer. Okay. So I became a dietitian truly to be my own first client. Like, it was a very selfish reason. I wanted to find answers for myself. So I truly had gut issues for as far back as I can remember. And, you know, looking back at my timeline, you know, I had a lot of antibiotics as a baby, as a kid, you know, mold exposure, genetics, food allergies, you know, looking back, the timeline totally makes sense. But throughout my childhood and throughout, you know, up until high school, you know, obviously living with gut issues can be hard. So I didn’t really kind of self-advocate for it until high school. You know, of course, like my mom took me to the doctor, tried to find out, but, you know, that didn’t really lead to many places. But high school, you know, you are more embarrassed about things.

So I started to really notice that my stomach always hurts and this wasn’t normal. So I started to really get into nutrition and I became obsessed with it. So I knew I wanted to pursue a career in this. So I actually went to college knowing I wanted to be a dietician right off the bat. But this is also when my gut issues were at an all-time peak. So I was really just, you know, on this like passion project to find out answers to really why people’s stomach hurts and what can you eat. And you know, the answer is that everyone else is looking for, right? And so as I started college, like anyone, I dove into an elimination diet. I really started to pull back on entire food groups. And at this time I also found out about food allergies. So a lot of pieces of the puzzle were coming into play.

But the elimination diet, those very two pronged approach to elimination diets. I had this outcome of that I started to eat more whole foods and I totally kind of shifted the way I was eating and looked at products and what was actually in them. And I did a lot for the good, but what kind of no one tells you about, about elimination diets is kind of the mental emotional piece of it.

Ryann

Yeah.

Jamie

And so I know you can probably relate to a lot of that. And so as I started to really pull back on a lot of foods truly just to feel better, I started to realize all this fear around food. And I totally saw this shift. And granted, I was training to be a dietitian, right? So you’re trained to pick up on these cues. So I realized that this relationship with food was not healthy, and it wouldn’t actually like benefit my health goals long term. And I think my true wake up call for that was, you know, I lost a lot of unintentional weight. I lost a lot of hair and you see those nutritional negative side effects, right? And I think the most infuriating part about kind of that part of it was that people compliment you, right? They tell you that you look better because you lost weight and you know, kind of all the things that you know so much about that, you know, all of these public compliments, you know, you never know.

Yes, you never know the place where they’re coming from. So, I began to really realize that this relationship was not healthy, but you’re kind of in the standstill point, which is where I see most of my clients come to me. Where they’ve tried elimination diets, their relationship with food is now kind of disordered, and they don’t know what to do next. And that’s exactly where I was. So I really started to challenge my own food fear. And I started to try to introduce foods that I could tolerate and that worked with me. And as I really navigated this process, that’s where legal came from. So the foods that I started to include in my diet and I found worked for me, so whether they were allergy free and those that worked for me, not just physically, but like mentally and emotionally. Like those were my legal foods. And so throughout grad school and my family, all my friends, like everyone knew the term legal. You know, is that legal for you? It became kind of a thing, right? It became-

Ryann

Okay.

Jamie

Yeah, it became a brand before it was a brand. So that’s where my practice name, Legal Living, came from. But then in grad school, psoriasis came into the picture as well. So I don’t know if you’re familiar, but skin issues are very well correlated with gut issues. So this was when I was like, okay, it’s time to double down, right? We’re not doing something right. And, you know, as you’re familiar with as well, kind of that it’s an emotional journey, right? The whole time. And it’s a lot of mental obstacles you have to get through. And as a dietitian, it’s kind of defeating why, you know, I’m now six years in and I’ve yet to find the answer.

Ryann

Right.

Jamie

So, yeah. So at this point I took a different approach. So I kind of took it from a functional lens and it was everything I was hoping for. I was able to clear up my psoriasis from a nutritional standpoint. I was able to alleviate my gut issues and it was just, it was powerful. So that whole kind of timeline of my academic history, my experience and what I’ve learned to help really my own symptoms is what I put into my program, right? So I tell my clients I wanna help them find their legal and mentally, emotionally and physically, because I think it can define all three things. So that’s really kind of the timeline of why I became a dietitian and why I’m here.

Ryann

I love that. I love that. And I love that you bring in that mental, physical and emotional because there are all of those elements which we are absolutely going to dive into. But I feel like what I would love first and foremost for you to kind of clarify is like, what is a healthy functioning gut feel like, look like? Because I feel like the new quote, I feel fat has moved into I am bloated and where it’s like, okay, but at some level bloating is natural. So kind of clarifying what is like a natural gut response to eating via blow and what is like, okay, maybe we should check that.

Jamie

Yeah, so definitely, so what would be abnormal? I guess we can start there. It’s like when you eat food and you immediately have that, either it’s super heavy feeling in your stomach or you either motility is super quick. So kind of if you go to the restroom immediately, or if you kind of have that like six month pregnant belly right away, right? Those are all some big red flags. To even like burning when you’re eating, any type of like gnawing pain, those are all things that you kind of want to look out for that that’s not normal. But, you know, feeling like if you had maybe a very dense meal and feeling full. And that’s normal, like that feeling of after eating. But if you eat something on the lighter side and you still feel that horrific bloating, that’s when we kind of see the spectrum of normal versus unnormal.

Ryann

Yeah, what causes bloating? Like what is actually happening when bloating happens?

Jamie

Gas, gas accumulation in the guts. And too, it can just be a lot, you know, especially with those who struggle with constipation, you know, it’s just like fecal matter that’s actually stuck in the intestines. So a lot of factors, but a lot of it comes back to gas. You know, that’s why they say, you know, drinking quickly can cause bloating, carbonated beverages, using a straw, kind of all those like simpler things, because they just, they create more air.

Ryann

So with natural bloating, right? Like the natural gases, I guess, that accumulate when you eat like a regular meal. Is there anything that can relieve that faster or is it just kind of like the digestion process of time?

Jamie

So, yeah, absolutely they can. So a lot of it is going to be, because to kind of like preface this, those two kind of phases of digestion. Mechanical is in the mouth, mechanical is in the mouth, and then chemical happens in the stomach intestines further on. So mechanical digestion is what you can really double down on. So chewing slower, sitting down at a table, really taking your time. They always say like the power of breaking bread. So like the power of like sitting at a table with other humans and communicating and taking your time and like enjoying the experience rather than just the food. So that in itself is huge. You know, avoid chugging a lot of beverages with your meal, carbonated beverages, eating quickly, so kind of inhaling food. So a lot of that is going to be big steps with to prevent that bloating.

Ryann

Okay, so back to your normal point when we’re like, okay, red flag, red flag, red flag. Can you differentiate really quickly the difference between like a food sensitivity versus intolerance versus like an actual allergy and how to kind of go about figuring that out if you are having some of these red flags that you just kind of expressed?

Jamie

Yeah, so food allergy I’ll start with because it’s like the biggest and the most severe. So a food allergy is commonly the word allergy a lot of people use with any type of adverse reaction to food, but it’s actually should only be used for true food allergy. And this is when the immune system learns to attack a particular substance for an unknown reason, and then it creates that IGE antibody. So this includes like then the respiratory system, the immune system, and this can then be deadly. So this is very severe. And the only way to find out a food allergy is through an allergist. A dietician cannot diagnose a food allergy. Okay. So you have to see an allergist who can specialize in that. And then a food intolerance, you know, the most common is like lactose intolerance. And this doesn’t involve the immune system whatsoever. This is just, this is very heavy in the digestive system and you lack that enzyme to break down that food. So like a lactose intolerance, you lack lactase, the enzyme to break down lactose.

Ryann

Oh, okay. Okay.

Jamie

That’s where that connection comes into play. And then a food sensitivity is primarily what I work with. And this comes from a lot of disturbance in the gut, a lot of inflammation, a lot of gut lining damage. And food sensitivities can be tricky too, because it can be a delayed response. So people don’t just like eat a food and immediately see the reaction. You know, it’s why I always say like people do like a CSI investigation of like what the heck caused them to be so sick because they truly have no idea, you know? And cause it’s like, you were like, what’s today? Yesterday. And you were like, constant. It’s like that meme of when it’s like all of the sciencey stuff around, like that’s literally what it is. And so it can be a delayed response. And the great thing about food sensitivities is they can actually go away as you improve your immunity and your gut. So food sensitivities aren’t necessarily a forever thing. You just really have to double down on working on your gut environments to really help alleviate those.

Ryann

Ooh, okay. So what would that look like if someone was experiencing some sensitivities? Does that mean add more in, cut them out for a while? I mean, how do you even begin with that?

Jamie

Yeah, so in terms of cutting them out, I mean, obviously they would want to, especially if they’re not working with somebody, because you want to somewhat feel better, right? You’re not gonna eat a food if it makes you feel terrible. You know, like some point to common sense, but you definitely wanna ask why you’re having that sensitivity, you know, take it one step deeper. So that what I always refer to as gut environment support with my clients. And one is going to be doing stool testing is what I do with my clients to actually look at what their gut environment looks like.

But things you can kind of start doing would be to really start optimizing what you’re eating, you know, blood sugar control and really like fueling your body properly. You know, I always tell my clients choose one meal and double down on it. Like, don’t overwhelm yourself. Like, choose breakfast, chew slowly, take your time, include protein, fat, fiber, and a starch, you know, make that breakfast like you’re A game and then move forward, right? And then another thing is actually minerals. So one of those is actually sodium. So sodium, which I know we got a lot of hash from because it’s known as a bad thing. So it’s always kind of surprising to people. But sodium is important for the pH regulation of your stomach, which has a huge role in…

And so it’s that chloride in sodium, you know, stomach acid is hydrochloric acid. So we like our stomach nice and acidic. So using real salt, you know, that’s not stripped from all the trace minerals that’s in it, instead of refined salts, you know, that’s a huge step in its own because not many people are actually using like real salt, you know, and it’s not the salt that’s in like a McDonald’s French fry like we’re talking. We’re talking like the real, you know, like Redmond salt is a great example, like Celtic salt. So that’s a place to start as well. And you know, minerals like magnesium, potassium, those ones are huge too for like motility and enzyme production and bile, like all the digestive juices, like all the components that go into digestion. So I would say doubling down on like meal building, adding in real salt and potassium and magnesium are going to be great places to start there.

Ryann

And do you recommend like a supplement for that or are there foods that you can just eat more of to get the magnesium and potassium from?

Jamie

Yeah. So I always try to recommend food first, right, as a dietician, you know, to not outsource so much on supplements. And but sometimes for potassium and magnesium, we see them kind of lackluster in food only because our soil is not as rich as it used to be in minerals. That’s where minerals come from, is our soil. So magnesium and potassium I do tend to outsource, but potassium we can actually get from like coconut water or like powdered coconut water are great ones, or like bumble root hydration powder is a great one, cura packets, so you can definitely outsource for potassium and then magnesium is typically one I do too.

Ryann

Okay. Like a powdered form. Okay. Do you have any, if somebody was going to outsource and find it in a powder or a supplement, like any brands off the top of your mind that you’re like, this is like a legit third party tested brand?

Jamie

Yeah. Yeah, so from magnesium, you can do what’s called MagSooth by Jigsaw Health. So that’s a great one. It has like a limey taste to it. It has like a little bit of a flavor. So then you can add that with either like coconut water or a Cure hydration packet. So that’s gonna give you that potassium. And you can do like the lemon lime one. And then you can add in some more Redmond’s real salt. So that would give you a good mineral mocktail. And I always call that recipe like the margarita because truly that’s what it tastes like. And you can add more lime in there. So that max sooth plus like a cure hydration packet, you can add some more lime in there and then put some Redmond’s real salt, like a fourth of a teaspoon.

Ryann

Okay.

Jamie

Yeah.

Ryann

All right, so I want to know, because I need some clarification, like the difference between gut issues and IBS. Like when does it move into, okay, maybe we’re actually working with IBS and what is IBS?

Jamie

Sure, so IBS is technically like a functional gut issue. And what that means is that typically clients, like someone will go to the doctor and they get all this testing done to find out nothing’s wrong with them. And that’s where IBS comes into play. And it’s because you’ve ruled out all the bigger things like ulcerative colitis and Crohn’s disease or celiac. And so when you’re kind of lackluster in like a disease, you’re given this like functional diagnosis of IBS. And it’s kind of split into two subtypes, three actually. So it’s either constipation dominant, diarrhea dominant, and then kind of a combo, you know, a beautiful combo of both. So that’s kind of where IBS comes to.

So IBS is kind of, it’s a synonym of gut issues. They’re very much the same thing, you know, because people tend to think, you know, unless they got a diagnosis of IBS, they don’t have IBS, but it’s very, it’s based off symptoms, right? There’s no lab that will tell you that you have IBS. So if you have those symptoms of, you know, constipation, diarrhea, gas, bloating, whatever they are, they’re all kind of grouped into that, like functional diagnosis of IBS.

Ryann

And is treatment to that similar like what you described before and, you know, looking at doubling down on the things or is it totally different?

Jamie

Yeah, it’s same as gut issues. So that’s like the very, very same thing. So like treatment is very heavy in nutrients when it comes to IBS, right? There’s no really medication that’s going to help alleviate those symptoms other than like a laxative or, you know like Imodium to help with diarrhea. Like, unless you go kind of that bandaid route are we thinking that’s really gonna help, you know, deep rooted at your symptoms, will be very nutrition heavy.

Ryann

Yeah, so when doubling down and figuring out these foods and with the, I wanna say, the well-known elimination diet, I mean, how do you approach that with your clients in a way that doesn’t create this emotional distress? Like, can you do it without emotional distress? I mean, to me, like, after working with so many clients moving from restriction and struggling with binge eating and the food scarcity fear, I mean, is there a way to go about that? Or have you found a way to go about that that doesn’t create this, you know, chaos around food?

Jamie

Yeah, so I think I mentioned this before too, and similar to your clientele, you know, people come to you in this distressed state. You know, they’re confused why broccoli is hurting their stomach, and they’re confused why they’re fasting till noon. Like they’ve been fed all of this information and they’re so confused. So what I try to do is I try to not even mention taking away foods. I don’t want to, you know, feed, fuel that fire, right. So as they come into me, I teach them basic how to build a meal, right, what we actually need to fuel ourselves, and how to eat and when to eat. And we focus on just traditional dietary advice. And then from there, as they start to learn like what they should be eating, and what feels good, they’re able to start to navigate what foods are actually triggers for them. You know, I guide them, like, look out for these foods and tell me how you feel around them. And I try to do small, like, clumps of foods versus like a laundry list of, you know, give out all these foods and then like, update me in two weeks, you know? Because that’s so overwhelming and so, you know, terrifying because when it comes to gut issues and IBS, like that laundry list is gonna be apples and cashews, and it’s gonna be all the healthy things. So, you know, they end up then, you know, too many no’s is gonna lead to a binge-worthy yes.

Ryann

Right.

Jamie

At some point. So then they come to me and then, you know, they’ll boomerang back as kind of a binge eater or emotional eater. So we wanna try to avoid that relationship. So we definitely focus on foundations of just how to eat, when to eat, very basic stuff that doesn’t feel too overwhelming at first. They feel like they’re learning something that they’ve never learned before, right? Stuff that like Google doesn’t tell you.

Ryann

Yeah.

Jamie

And then from there, we take it one step deeper.

Ryann

Can you give us like a little 101 on how to build a meal?

Jamie

Yeah. So, I always tell clients that you want to include protein, a fat, fiber, and then a starch. So, it’s a good like four-step foundation to it. You know, so like half your plate vegetables, you know, about like 20 to 30 grams of protein, some healthy fat, you know, like an avocado, some nuts, some olives, and then a starch. So, whatever that is for you. Rice, a potato, you know, oats, whatever that is. And so we really just start with one meal and we just start with breakfast. Let’s just optimize breakfast because we don’t want to overwhelm them. So just start with one meal and once they really learn what works for them, we’ll take it one step further and move on to the other ones and snacks and really have to navigate that.

Ryann

Yeah, yeah. And I feel like figuring out probably what you like and what feels good goes into that as well and just learning. I mean I just think of it in the sense of like reconnecting with your body like taking that FBI mode of what is actually going on but also getting really really connected into what am I feeling? What is happening? Like paying attention to all of those symptoms as they arise like no different from reconnecting to hunger and fullness like we can’t understand if we’re not paying attention and not listening. And I think that like getting back to the basics and the fundamental and then going from there, I really love how you take that approach of like adding in and figuring that out because I think that this can be a very triggering thing.

Jamie

Yeah, and those, I definitely get a lot of suspicion around the facts, like how do I navigate this with elimination diets? Like kind of how you pegs, which is normal, right? You want people to be, you want to unleash curiosity to some point, but there’s actually studies done, right? And I’m never denying the fact that like the low FODMAP diet, which is like a typical elimination diet for IBS. Like I’m not denying that any of it works because if it does, it’s the fact that it’s the relationship with food, that’s kind of the biggest red flag. So studies done on the fact that like one group does traditional dietary advice, like very much like my approach, how to eat, when to eat, what we should be eating, you know, look out for these foods and tell me how you feel around them.

And then those that did a strict elimination diet and they got the same results in terms of gut alleviation symptoms. But one preserved the relationship with food, if not improved it. And then the other group, you know, is no longer eating apples and pistachios and oats and, you know, has no idea what to do next, right? So there’s that clear, you know, difference between if we can get the same results and preserve so much of that mental-emotional side, I don’t see why we shouldn’t do it, you know.

Ryann

Right, right. Do you find I mean, I know that you’ve mentioned dairy, any other foods that you have found to be like, very common and just like a very like across the board, if you’re struggling, let’s look out for this or is it very individualized?

Jamie

Kind of both. So it can be very individualized, but like when it comes to like someone with diarrhea, ingredients like erythritol, artificial sweeteners, sugar alcohols, inulin, like these tend to be like direct bullets for them. And even like things like garlic and onion, right? Like we look at things like that. And then like my more constipation dominant clients, right? They’re kind of more sensitive to too much fiber, not enough fiber, because you know, one way of the spectrum can make them more constipated and then one way, you know, can actually help motility. So I would say kind of looking at ingredients like inulin and erythritol and stuff, that’s a place to start. And dairy, you know, poor quality dairy especially tends to be a trigger for some people. But unpasteurized dairy tends to be more tolerated for some. So kind of navigating And C too, not everyone who can’t tolerate cow’s dairy can tolerate goats and sheep. So it’s all about experimentation and finding, changing up the quality, opting for higher quality dairy products. And if it doesn’t work for you, try something new. I think it’s just all about that mentality of taking one step forward instead of living in that moment.

Ryann

Totally. Okay, so I’m absolutely going to switch gears right now. And because I am like such a mindset gal, you know, we’re working on psychology and all of that stuff. I feel like what isn’t talked a lot with gut stuff is the connection between gut health and your production of serotonin actually is and like that connection between gut and serotonin stuff?

Jamie

Yeah so it’s always surprising to people that over 90% of serotonin is actually produced in the gut.

Ryann

Right? When I heard that I was like what?

Jamie

Yeah yeah I mean that gut brain access it’s a true thing so serotonin kind of just take it one step back it’s a neurotransmitter that controls and stabilizes your mood, but it also controls and stabilizes your digestive system. So it has a huge impact on motility, how much mucus is created in your intestines, and kind of your sensitivity to stuff as well. So it has a huge impact on digestion as well. And that connection kind of comes from gut bacteria, creates neurotransmitters, like GABA, and like dopamine, and like serotonin. And then, and these neurotransmitters communicate between the brain and then the nervous system in the gut. So like the easiest way to explain this upstream pathway is like when you’re nervous and you have butterflies, or like if someone’s like anxious and they feel like they have to use the restroom, right? It’s this nervous system connection there. But the serotonin connection is very related to kind of the quality of your gut health, so how does that good bacteria look? And if it’s really optimizing the amount of serotonin that’s being produced.

Ryann

So would you say if somebody works, if someone is really struggling with gut stuff, or maybe you can even speak to your own example, I mean, your own experience and struggling with mental health, like that can improve as gut health improves with that serotonin production?

Jamie

It absolutely can. I never, I would never say I promise it, right? That one’s always like a shot in the dark, you know? I don’t like promise results of things I can’t technically control, but it absolutely can. And I see it a lot. And granted, because of this connection, a lot of my clients do come to me that have depressive thoughts and anxiety, ADHD, whatever it is. And so they have this internal goal of maybe can I come off my medication one day and maybe can I make steps forward? So it’s always something that we definitely talk about and we know gut health we hope to see that correlation.

Ryann

Okay and with improvement of gut health I always wonder because when I hear like gut health my first thought is like probiotic. Is a probiotic something that you would recommend that we have and what is the difference between a probiotic and prebiotic?

Jamie

Yeah, so it’s a great question for gut health. We’ll just put that one there. So probiotic is actually the beneficial bacteria that’s in your gut. So it really helps to replenish and repopulate that bacteria. Do you have to take a supplement? No, if you’re getting food sources. So food sources are like yogurt or kefir or like sauerkraut or kombucha. But if you feel like you’re kind of lackluster in probiotic food sources, then I would outsource to a supplement. And then the difference, oh yeah, go ahead.

Ryann

I was just going to ask something totally random. Why do probiotics need to be refrigerated?

Jamie

So they actually don’t need to be. Yeah. So, you know, if you think about it, like if it has to be refrigerated and then it comes into your body that’s not 42 degrees, like a refrigerator, how is it going to stay alive? I’ve always wondered that. Yeah. So, um, I, all the probiotics I use in my practice, none of them are refrigerated.

Ryann

Okay.

Jamie

So they don’t have to be. I think it’s kind of like a marketing thing that people think like if it’s refrigerated, it must be better.

Ryann

Right.

Jamie

But actually no, it doesn’t have to be refrigerated. You just want to get like a good spore based one. That’s more important than like worrying about if it’s refrigerated.

Ryann

Okay, and then before going into prebiotics, any brands that you would recommend?

Jamie

Yeah, so Thrive has a good one. Bio Cult is a good one too. And then Mega Spore Biotic is a good one as well. So those are three I typically turn to.

Ryann

Good to know. Yeah. All right, prebiotics, what’s beyond that? I’ve never understood.

Jamie

It can be confusing. So prebiotics are fiber that actually promotes the growth and of our beneficial bacteria. So prebiotics feed probiotics, so they work in harmony together. And they’re important because so prebiotics, the whole function of them is that our body can’t break them down. So they make their way to the colon, which is like the end of the digestive system, undigested, so that they’re able to really ferment and feed that good bacteria. And when they do that, they create short-chain fatty acids, which then are so important for like gut lining and numerous benefits in the body in terms of like anti-inflammatory stuff. But biggest picture is that probiotics are your good bacteria, they help to make it thrive. And then probiotics feed that good bacteria and help it ferment and, you know, stay at robust levels.

Ryann

Okay, okay. So interesting. There’s so many different components to it. So I wanna like, from all of that, right? Like if somebody is like, I am so overwhelmed, like I don’t even know where to start slash I don’t have the money right now to invest working with a dietician, but I like, am really struggling with something going on with my stomach, where it’s like, when I eat, I’m often having more stomach aches than when I don’t. What are some of the first things that you would recommend somebody simply do if they’re just like, just in the beginning, feeling very overwhelmed, but can’t necessarily work with a dietician yet?

Jamie

Yeah, so, mostly, a lot of the stuff will be stuff I mentioned. So really, because at the end of the day, I like to tell people, like, you want to think of it like an inflammation bucket, like, totally pull back on the mindset of like, I have diarrhea and like, think of the fact of like, an inflammation bucket. And your goal is to start to unpack that and unfill it. So you can start doing that by, you know, blood sugar control. So like building balanced meals, like we talked about, optimizing your minerals, which are going to do things for energy, which will do things for gut health, and help that blood sugar control.

So you can start there. And when it comes to like probiotics and prebiotics, I would necessarily not focus on those right away because sometimes probiotics are not well tolerated by people with like kind of chronic gut issues, especially if they have something deeper happening, like an infection or a parasite or something. So I wouldn’t even turn there first. I would see how you kind of tolerate food sources. You know, if you feel like you eat yogurt and it makes your stomach hurt, like that’s a red flag. Like you’d want to ask deeper questions. But start with food sources first before kind of outsourcing to a supplement. And then when it comes to like vegetables, those are going to be our prebiotics, our green leafy vegetables or onion or garlic. So root vegetables, like get more of those in and take it at a very minimalist approach and then kind of work from there.

You know, like people always love to like start their gut health journey and like pound sauerkraut and they’re like, this isn’t going so well. And then like, for a reason, you know? So like, you have to start low and slow, you know? Start with the basics because it’s so important. And two, like aside from food stuff, like sleep more, like get sunlight in the morning, go for more walks. Like if you’re constipated, like add two or three more walks in the day. Like we need more movement. Like a lot of the stuff that’s like, you know, it’s simple, but not easy, you know? So it’s like the things that you don’t wanna double down on, but you have to. So I would start with a lot of that stuff, you know, sleep habits and using blue light glasses before bed and like all the little stuff that adds up to something big, you know?

Ryann

Yeah, yeah, that’s a good point. Like all of those other things kind of play in and I feel like we often forget that and focus so much on the food and then neglect kind of the self-care elements that also play a role as well.

Jamie

Yeah, I mean, absolutely. I have whole, you know, like months dedicated to doubling down on morning routines and nighttime routines with my clients because it’s so important. And circadian rhythm, which is cycles of night and dark, or night and day, that controls your digestive system. Tells your body of when it’s ready for food to come. So that has a role. So we have to think about everything in order to really help your symptoms big picture.

Ryann

So last question just in relation to like binging and eating a little more than is comfortable in the stomach. Just in what you know about like gut health and that kind of stuff. So when someone gets really full, let’s just say it like that, taking away like all of the terms. When somebody gets really full, what are some things that you recommend to help kind of alleviate pain, help with digestion, kind of move that food through where it’s like, okay, I have a stomachache, not necessarily because I have gut problems, but because I ate to a level where I’m really full.

Jamie

Yeah, so I would definitely movement. So definitely like go on walks, hot compresses can definitely help and to like actually massaging your stomach. So like, doing peristalsis for your body, like move the food down. So like doing like downward massages on your stomach, you can do that, add more like magnesium to help with like motility and really just don’t overthink it more than anything, you know, don’t, you know, because a lot of times when people get that point that creates them to actually binge more because they think, well, my stomach already hurts, so I might as well go home, you know, so I think a lot of that is navigating those thoughts more than anything.

So I think like I always tell my clients, like, if you find yourself going to the kitchen and you’re an emotional eater, do something for 15 minutes that’s going to calm you down and take, you know, 10 steps away. Like, go make your bed. Do something so simple, but it occupies that time. You know, unlock the dishwasher, unload, you know, obviously I’m not telling you not to eat if you’re hungry, but I don’t want you eating in that emotional state because that’s leads to poor digestion as well.

Ryann

Yeah, yeah. Oh, so many freaking good things that you just shared with us. I feel like, oh my gosh, I just like took a whole like college class. Okay, so last thing, water, just like I love asking this question to dietitians because I feel like there’s so much false Information out there where it’s like, oh Just in general What are a few things that you wish everybody knew about gut health like to just like clarify some of the in this? Information or the things that you see often just like the basics that you’re like I feel like I’m saying this over and over and over. I just wish everybody knew this.

Jamie

Yeah, so I think one thing would be, you don’t have to be plant-based to improve your gut health. I think that’s a big one. Like meat can have a dominant role in your diet and that’s fine. Another one being like, you don’t have to give up nightshades. I get a lot of people that think they have to give up nightshades to like red vegetables and things like, not necessary. That’s totally not necessary. And I think too, like the role of minerals, like everyone focuses on fiber, which I love, but like fiber got its time to shine. Like I think minerals needs the spotlight.

And so I think minerals need more attention. So adding in that mineral mocktail daily that I mentioned, I think that’s a huge step in itself. And just like the importance to a blood sugar control, I think everyone thinks they have to be a diabetic to care about it. But it’s just so foundational to like your body’s health and inflammation and you know, it’s just as stressful to the body as it is to be stressed. Then you have poor blood sugar control. So I think those are the things that I would clarify first is that like pull back from the probiotics, the prebiotics, the fiber, like pull back from everything that Google has told you and like focus on the things that matter first, you know, that matter more.

Ryann

I love that so much. Okay, now I have some questions for you that are totally irrelevant to what we just discussed, just so everybody can get to know you a little bit better. And I just feel like it’s always super nice to have these questions to pull away from your expertise to get to know you. So first and foremost, where are you from?

Jamie

Chicago, Illinois.

Ryann

Are you originally from there?

Jamie

Mm-hmm. So I live in the city now and then I grew up in the suburbs

Ryann

Oh Amazing. Okay. I always love to ask dietitians this question. What is a snack that you absolutely cannot live without?

Jamie

Oh I mean, maybe a chomp stick. I don’t know if you’re familiar with like chomp sticks like you need Mean I live for a chomp stick Chompstick. Oh, I love dried figs. I mean, people, that always surprise people. Like, I love a good, I love dried fruit. And I also think it’s kind of like a plot twist to people because it’s gotten so much like negative attention that like, so like when people see a dietitian eating like a fig, it like, it throws a curve ball. So I don’t know if like it’s that or I actually love a fig. Chompsticks, figs, I would definitely say like tight cream cheese, like Kite Hill dairy-free cream cheese is great with like crackers. I think those are kind of my non-negotiables. Nuts, I love nuts.

Ryann

So good, so good. Okay, fill in the blank. The thing I know way too much about is?

Jamie

Oh man, I mean probably gut bacteria.

Ryann

I mean, if you didn’t answer that, would we even be here right now? What is your number one beauty product?

Jamie

Ooh, that’s a good one. Honestly, maybe like a lip, I would say, maybe like a lip gloss.

Ryann

I feel like that. Anyone in particular, like brand that you’re like, this is it, this is.

Jamie

Oh, I love the one, oh my God, I’m blinking on the name. I think it’s called like Sine. It’s that, do you know, are you familiar? It’s like, it’s called like a lip mask, but it’s from Sephora. And I think it’s called Sine.

Ryann

I’m not.

Jamie

I love the Kapari one too.

Ryann

I love a good lip. I love a good lip. Okay, so you just won a contest and you get an endless supply of a product of your choice. What would you choose?

Jamie

Oh man, that’s a good question. Maybe like Siete products. I would say I’m a big Siete fan. I use a lot of their stuff. So maybe Siete.

Ryann

Yeah, I love their branding. Such a basic thing to say, but I really do. I really do. What is your favorite way to move your body?

Jamie

Oh, I love a walk. Like I go on the riverfront in Chicago. I love a good juicy walk. I always tell people. There’s nothing better. And then like I call my mom, it’s like I think it’s therapy in one. Definitely a walk. I love a good, you know, workout class. I love like the group setting and I think I have a Peloton, so I love the Peloton as well. So I think those are my three biggies.

Ryann

Love it. How do you take your coffee?

Jamie

With nut pods and monk fruit.

Ryann

Monk fruit?

Jamie

Yeah, it’s like, it’s a sweetener.

Ryann

Okay, I was like what? Crunchier smooth peanut butter.

Jamie

Oh, crunchy.

Ryann

And what’s your favorite thing to put it on?

Jamie

Apples, I would say classic.

Ryann

Yeah, like a honey crisp apple with crunchy peanut butter. Whoa, I really want that right now. Okay, how many alarms do you snooze before you wake up in the morning?

Jamie

So actually I am like I my body wakes up at 530 every day.

Ryann

Like you don’t even set an alarm?

Jamie

No.

Ryann

I feel like I’m pretty similar. I do set like a backup alarm where I’m like, I’m probably gonna wake up before this. But if I don’t, so I feel you on that. But I don’t know if I could never not set one for backup.

Jamie

In college I’d wake up at like 7.

Ryann

Yeah.

Jamie

I think since like, when I did clinicals, like at a hospital and I got up at like 430 and stuff, I think it totally like retrained my body to be like up at five. So I just go with it.

Ryann

And my last question, just because this is the Food Freedom Lab, what does food freedom mean to you?

Jamie

That’s a good question. I would definitely say it’s more so, you know, less on the food focus and more so on the other components of life that you’ve noticed mean more than just food. You know, less of the worry around what you should be eating. And, you know, I always was the person that brought snacks everywhere and was always so worried about having foods that I could tolerate. So I think that that takes away a lot of, you know, life. So I think focusing, I think food freedom is when you can actually enjoy life that goes beyond just food.

Ryann

So beautiful. All right, Jamie, where can everybody find you, learn from you, connect with you, give us all the places?

Jamie

Yeah, so my Instagram is Legal Living, which is one L in the middle, so it’s like one thing. My website is Legal Living as well, and those are two of my biggest platforms that I use. So mostly spend a lot of my time on Instagram. And you know, clients want to work with me, I have an application and that’s where they can find that and we can do a strategy call and see if we work.

Ryann

Amazing and I’ll have all of those links in the show notes below. Thank you so much again. This was so epic.

Jamie

Thank you.